AVERAGE Range on a Full Charge

[howardbc]

When I leave the house to run errands, I usually make 3-4 short trips. So when I figure out my EV miles at the end of the day, I'm only getting around 21-27 miles. But I learned that if I drive one long non-stop trip I can get at least 35 miles from the initial battery charge. That's using city streets, not the highway, and stopping only for traffic lights, but not turning off the ignition until my destination. 

 

My Lifetime Summary is still showing 120-130mpg after 7000+ miles. My brake score is usually around 90. I've spent a total of $269 on gas since I picked up the car in early April 2013. I just love this car. When I tell people I get 130mpg, the look on their faces is priceless. Their jaw drops and it's a few seconds before they can answer. 

 

The Summer heat here in Arizona definitely impacts the battery but not as badly as I expected. 

[EnergiCCAATS]

Have had our 2014 FFE Titanium for one week now, and my wife is now seeing range of 27 miles on a full charge (showing on the display).  Pretty amazed with this car so far!

[Apogee1]

I ran 1350 miles on 9 gallons of gas over 2 months, that's 150 MPG, and an average of 175 MPGe.  All without worrying about where we went, but used careful management of the EV Now and EV Later options.  I would have kept going, but I knew I had to make a major trip, so I filled up.  My next goal is to get 2000 miles on a single tank.  At one point in time, I got the MPGe up to 240. Average temp during this time period was 80, but there were several days in the mid 90's.  We are now hitting June, and the start of 100+ days.  I'm up to the challenge, I hope the Energi is too!

[EnergiCCAATS]

Yep, I'm so glad Ford derated the battery only miles from 21 to 19. 21 obviously isn't achievable.

 

[CapnBry]

Over the past month, I average 3.7 miles/kWh in the morning (with "climate" using ~1 bar) but 2.8 miles/kWh in the afternoon (where the 125F interior temperature means tons of "climate" usage). That gives me a little under 20 miles on a charge with mid-to-high-90s brake score and mid-80s driving score.

 

Someone needs to invent car windows that turn opaque when the vehicle is off so it stays nice and cool inside. I've got 3M Crystaline 70 on the sides and rear which helps tremendously but that giant windshield is wrecking it!

[Fat Fusion]

A few of my friends work here.  They're focusing on just that technology, but not for cars yet.

 

http://viewglass.com/product/overview/

[meyersnole]

Someone needs to invent car windows that turn opaque when the vehicle is off so it stays nice and cool inside. I've got 3M Crystaline 70 on the sides and rear which helps tremendously but that giant windshield is wrecking it!

 

I solved this with a quality custom sunscreen for the front window. It is expensive, but works so much better than the generic ones.  http://204.228.150.1/products/index.phtml?prod_id=uv&cust_id=covercraft&SYSTEM=cartlink&SESSIONID=notpassed&ACTION=

 

I posted this in my thread on stuff for the car here: http://www.fordfusionenergiforum.com/topic/636-stuff-for-the-car/?p=2056

 

There is also a long conversation on window tinting in that topic, screen protector for MFT, and the shark fin replacement for the antennae.

[shaggy314]

 

Someone needs to invent car windows that turn opaque when the vehicle is off so it stays nice and cool inside. I've got 3M Crystaline 70 on the sides and rear which helps tremendously but that giant windshield is wrecking it!

 

They have a clear ceramic that you can put on the front... surprised your tint shop didn't mention it.

[Hybridbear]

I picked 19 because based on my parents' experience with their C-Max Energi last year I expect that our range will be about 11-12 miles in the winter, 28-30 in the summer with no A/C and 23-25 in the summer with A/C. A lot also depends on the driver. My estimated range in the Focus Electric on a full charge is almost always 100-115 miles. My wife sees an estimate range of 75-85 miles. I'm still trying to get her to look at the dash to see how much power the HVAC is drawing and to adjust accordingly because I believe that's the cause of a lot of the difference since she's setting the HVAC such that the electric heater comes on sometimes in the summer. She's had trips to work that have been 400+ Wh/mi (~85 MPGe) because the car was preconditioned at 65 degrees and then she drove the entire trip to work with the HVAC set to 72.

[Pableau]

:headscratch:  I've had my 2014 FFE for 10 weeks, and I love it.  But currently, I'm only getting around 11 actual miles per charge.  The estimate was 21 at first in Sept. (temps 65-75). Now with temps in upper 50s on the way to work, and upper 60s on the way home, the estimated range is down to 15.  

My previous car was a 2010 Fusion Hybrid, so I've had 5 yrs to learn how to drive in a way that maximized the number of frustrated drivers going around me.  A martini glass on my roof would rarely spill :shrug:

 

I'd been chalking my low range up to the fact that my local trips are uphill one way (1.6% avg. grade, which is pretty gradual), but the downhill return ought to compensate, with regenerative braking (avg. score: 95).  My avg. speed is 25 - 30 mph. 

 

I do use the climate control, set to 72, but AC & heat shouldn't have to work very hard in our mild Bay Area climate.

 

I'm curious to learn how many of you folks with ranges near 30 miles are using advanced (hypermiling) techniques, or do any of you live in regions with hills?

 

Thanks,

Pableau

[murphy]

The heater is a 5kW resistance heater.  That will put a huge dent in your battery.  Turn the climate system off and watch the range number jump.  I regularly drive 10 miles for a meeting.  In the spring, summer, and fall I can easily make the round trip on battery.  In the winter I can only make half of the trip on battery.  The battery doesn't work very well in low temperatures.  You need to use GO times to preheat the cabin before you leave.  Then turn the climate off and use the seat heater and a warm coat and gloves.  The alternative, if you want to be warm, is to burn gasoline.

Edited November 27, 2014 at 04:39 PM by murphy

[Pableau]

Thanks, Murphy!

 

After driving 1 day with the climate control off, my estimated range went from 15 to 27.  That's more than I ever expected.  I look forward to see what it will do in warmer weather. 

 

It's amazing that the climate control could use 80% as much energy (in this mild climate) as propelling 2 tons of metal around town.

 

Now, with the help of the posts in the Climate Control forum, I'm hoping I can figure out how to activate "Vent" mode in my FFE.

[murphy]

Vent mode

 

Push max A/C  (forces temperature to LO)

Push A/C (Turns off A/C)

Push Recirculate.  (Turns off recirculate)

Set desired fan speed.

[oarabi1]

I got my 2014 Fusion Energi back in June....to be honest, I have never changed the way I drive and because nobody really educated me that the # of miles one gets on a charge depends on your driving efficiency, I never knew I needed to.  I always thought that I'd get 21 miles per charge and that's that.

 

Now that I've said that, up until the weather has gotten cold, I was getting between 18-20 miles on a full charge.  Some times I'd get 21-25 miles but that was rare.  Again, my braking sucks...now that the weather is cold outside, it says I'm fully charged, the car shows 19 miles available, and I rarely even get 15 miles on a charge now. 

 

Is this because of the cold weather or because of my poor driving habits.  I drive fast, I brake hard, and don't pay attention to the driving coach, etc.  Is it even possible now to get my range back up to where it was and where other people are saying they're at, jsut by changing my driving habits, or is the damage done?

 

Thanks!

[murphy]

Nothing has been damaged.  Battery effiency drops as the outside temperature drops.  The heater puts a heavy (5 kW) load on the battery.  Hard acceleration, although fun, will reduce mileage.  Smooth even braking will put energy back into the battery (regen).  If you press hard enough to engage the service brakes instead of charging the battery the energy is converted to heat.

 

Try a warm coat, heater off, and the seat heater turned up.

 

Using GO times to preheat the car using power from the power company can help but that requires a 240 volt charger to be effective.

[Fat Fusion]

Since wind resistance is the biggest influence on efficiency, it'd be interesting to do some simple things like lowering springs and see what that does.

[Ad Lee]

I got a Fusion Energi 4 weeks ago now. It has been a cold month, and I understand that causes lower mileage and low estimates of range from the car.  Temps here have been between 0 and 25 deg in the morning.

 

Still, even with using every bit of advice I have read here and elsewhere, the car estimates (fairly accurately) a EV range of 12 miles on average (10-15). This includes regular use of Go times, staying bundled up in the car with the heat turned down, using the seat heater at medium, driving conservatively and only on city streets, braking smoothly, etc. I have had a 15 mile range on only one morning out of about 28 mornings so far.

 

I am fairly disappointed, but looking forward to seeing how performance improves this spring. In the cold weather thread, I see another Minneapolitan claiming to get 20 miles EV range in similar temperatures, down from 25 no less. This makes me wonder if my battery is defective, or if it still needs time to become fully "primed".

 

Questions:

1) Is it possible that my battery is faulty, to be getting only 10miles EV range?

2) Who has a block heater installed? How did you do this? 

3) Has EV range seemed to go down in newer models? Many of the higher estimates I have seen have been in 2013 models.

4) Who else here averages 10-12 miles EV range in the winter? Do you really see that improve to 20-25 miles EV range in warmer months?

 

Thanks in advance.

Edited March 2, 2015 at 06:08 PM by Ad Lee

[murphy]

I typically get 27 in the summer and 11 in the winter.  The colder the battery gets the less efficient it is.

If you are driving in EV Only a block heater would do nothing for you.  It heats the engine which is not being used.

Turn the heater completely off and the number will go up.  It puts a significant load on the battery.

 

Another approach is to use EV Later until the car is warmed up and then switch to EV Now.

[Timewellspent]

 

Questions:

1) Is it possible that my battery is faulty, to be getting only 10miles EV range?

2) Who has a block heater installed? How did you do this? 

3) Has EV range seemed to go down in newer models? Many of the higher estimates I have seen have been in 2013 models.

4) Who else here averages 10-12 miles EV range in the winter? Do you really see that improve to 20-25 miles EV range in warmer months?

 

 

 

You said you are using go times.  Is this with a 120v charger? That maybe lowering your numbers.  As murphy stated the heater takes a lot of range off the car.  Have your heater off when you plug in at night and start out with out it and see what kind of range you show.  As soon as you turn it on, you will see it drop around 6 miles on the range.  I have a 2015 and I'm in Minnesota.  If you purchased your car in MN, it should have a block heater installed.  The plug is down by the driver side fog light. My range starts out at 17-18 miles without the heater on.

[Ad Lee]

 

 

You said you are using go times.  Is this with a 120v charger? That maybe lowering your numbers.  As murphy stated the heater takes a lot of range off the car.  Have your heater off when you plug in at night and start out with out it and see what kind of range you show.  As soon as you turn it on, you will see it drop around 6 miles on the range.  I have a 2015 and I'm in Minnesota.  If you purchased your car in MN, it should have a block heater installed.  The plug is down by the driver side fog light. My range starts out at 17-18 miles without the heater on.

 

 

 

Thanks. 

 

I am plugging into a regular 120V outlet - I'm planning on upgrading to 240V. Thing is, I've charged up in garages with 240V, with the same result.

 

I will mess around with just leaving the heater off, though I don't foresee actually driving around with no heat at all when it's below freezing.

 

Your description of the range dropping by about 7 miles brings up another point. At times, especially in the first week after I brought the car home, the range would be around 17-19, and would then immediately drop to 10-15 within a split second. I suspect that delay was the car recalculating the estimated range based on the ambient temperature, and maybe based on the heater starting up.

 

I haven't seen an engine block heater plug, I will check again. I still wonder whether having the engine heated up at first might provide a bit more heat to the cabin or other components that wouldn't have to be drawn from the battery.

[Platinum15Ti]

I parked the car at work Friday with 2 battery miles remaining. The temp was around 0 degrees F. I had a 2015 F150 for the weekend. Today, when I left work, it was 35 degrees F and as soon as I pushed the ignition I had 4 battery miles remaining, so I believe the temp plays a role in the range.

Edited March 3, 2015 at 01:02 AM by Platinum15Ti

[larryh]

Thanks. 

 

I am plugging into a regular 120V outlet - I'm planning on upgrading to 240V. Thing is, I've charged up in garages with 240V, with the same result.

 

I will mess around with just leaving the heater off, though I don't foresee actually driving around with no heat at all when it's below freezing.

 

Your description of the range dropping by about 7 miles brings up another point. At times, especially in the first week after I brought the car home, the range would be around 17-19, and would then immediately drop to 10-15 within a split second. I suspect that delay was the car recalculating the estimated range based on the ambient temperature, and maybe based on the heater starting up.

 

I haven't seen an engine block heater plug, I will check again. I still wonder whether having the engine heated up at first might provide a bit more heat to the cabin or other components that wouldn't have to be drawn from the battery.

 

The engine block heater is not going help much with heating the cabin.  It heats the engine and coolant up to around 85 F when it is cold.  That is not enough to make much of an impact on heating the cabin.  It takes a lot more energy than that when it is cold--the engine block heater provides much less than 1% of the energy required to warm the cabin.  The most effective way to heat the cabin is to use preconditioning with a 240 V Charger.   I am able to warm the cabin up to around 50 F when it is cold using the energy from an electrical outlet (you need to park the car in a garage for best results).  That is adequate to allow me to drive my 8 mile commute to work in the morning without using much heat.  My EV range in the winter is around 18 miles. 

 

I use the engine block heater to prevent the engine from coming on.  In EV mode, the engine will start if the engine temperature falls below 15 F.  I can heat up the engine using the engine block heater to prevent the engine temperature from falling below that threshold when the outside temperature is below 0 F. 

Edited March 4, 2015 at 09:27 AM by larryh

[Hybridbear]

I got a Fusion Energi 4 weeks ago now. It has been a cold month, and I understand that causes lower mileage and low estimates of range from the car.  Temps here have been between 0 and 25 deg in the morning.

 

Still, even with using every bit of advice I have read here and elsewhere, the car estimates (fairly accurately) a EV range of 12 miles on average (10-15). This includes regular use of Go times, staying bundled up in the car with the heat turned down, using the seat heater at medium, driving conservatively and only on city streets, braking smoothly, etc. I have had a 15 mile range on only one morning out of about 28 mornings so far.

 

I am fairly disappointed, but looking forward to seeing how performance improves this spring. In the cold weather thread, I see another Minneapolitan claiming to get 20 miles EV range in similar temperatures, down from 25 no less. This makes me wonder if my battery is defective, or if it still needs time to become fully "primed".

 

Questions:

1) Is it possible that my battery is faulty, to be getting only 10miles EV range?

2) Who has a block heater installed? How did you do this? 

3) Has EV range seemed to go down in newer models? Many of the higher estimates I have seen have been in 2013 models.

4) Who else here averages 10-12 miles EV range in the winter? Do you really see that improve to 20-25 miles EV range in warmer months?

 

Thanks in advance.

We see 20 miles of range with no heat in the winter predicted on MFM. I've been able to stretch it to 25 even with freeway driving by keeping the heat off. Since we park in a heated garage the car is warm even in winter.

 

There are multiple factors that result in less range in winter independent of using the heat.

• transmission fluid is colder and thus there is more internal friction
• tires are colder & thus have higher rolling resistance
• tire pressure decreases with temperature which increases rolling resistance
• cold air is more dense which increases aerodynamic drag
• the HVB is colder and thus has less capacity

My wife & I are fortunate to park in a heated garage which is typically around 64-68 F in the winter and is 55 F at the coldest on the most extreme cold MN nights. I use the block heater to keep the transmission fluid warm and to ensure that the ICE won't turn on as Larry explained. Parking in a warm garage keeps the HVB much warmed. With HVB temps typically in the 70s I see the Energy to Empty (ETE) on a full charge around 7.15 kWh. When the HVB is colder, say 20-30 F, a full charge is only about 6.1-6.2 kWh. That's almost a 15% loss in usable energy for driving in EV mode.

 

My parents C-Max Energi sits in a detached, unheated garage. Their EV range in winter without heat is only about 17 miles. Their HVB regularly shows only about 6.2 kWh when fully charged in winter & 7.15 kWh when fully charged in the summer. In the summer they can go close to 30 miles without AC, so can we. They are also using the block heater to keep the ICE from turning on and to heat the transmission fluid.

 

The transmission fluid will heat up as you drive. For example, this past Saturday the car sat outside for about 11.5 hours in the cold. During that time it dropped from being in the mid 90s when I parked to 13 F when I left. While driving home the tranny fluid warmed up substantially, but it takes time. The first few miles had a very low MPGe number because the internal friction was so high. Once the fluid got above 50 F the MPGe seemed to go up substantially.

 

Check out these threads for more info:

http://www.fordfusionenergiforum.com/topic/1683-obd-ii-data-for-hvb

http://www.fordfusionenergiforum.com/topic/1446-cold-weather-observations

 

In one of them Larry posted a great graph showing the transmission fluid internal friction at different temperatures. They're long threads, but I'd encourage you to scan through all the pages because there's a lot of great info about understanding the HVB performance & range as well as data about the cold weather. You may have seen them already but I wanted to make sure you knew about all the great data Larry has gathered.

 

You said you are using go times.  Is this with a 120v charger? That maybe lowering your numbers.  As murphy stated the heater takes a lot of range off the car.  Have your heater off when you plug in at night and start out with out it and see what kind of range you show.  As soon as you turn it on, you will see it drop around 6 miles on the range.  I have a 2015 and I'm in Minnesota.  If you purchased your car in MN, it should have a block heater installed.  The plug is down by the driver side fog light. My range starts out at 17-18 miles without the heater on.

Great point about the 120V charger. I used it this past Saturday while parked outside all day and setting it to 85 F the car was slightly warmed inside (45 F) and the heater core coolant was up to 85 F. I assume that the preconditioning happened for an hour. When I precondition using 240V even when parked outside at my parents' house I can get the interior temp up over 80 F with the Go Time set to 85 F. At home the car usually shows an interior temp of about 93 F when preconditioning to 85 F. This allows us to drive in winter without using heat since we start out in such a warm car. We do the same thing in our Focus Electric.

[Energized]

One thing I'm certainly happy about is that after two years of owning the FFE, I haven't noticed any reduction in range. Its common to read about the battery issues on the Leaf, and the problems people have with degradation of range.

[jeff_h]

One thing I'm certainly happy about is that after two years of owning the FFE, I haven't noticed any reduction in range. Its common to read about the battery issues on the Leaf, and the problems people have with degradation of range.

 

I'm noting a slight hit, will pass 44k miles today... but don't know if a different set of tires is a factor.  I have a spreadsheet with logged MPG of the commutes back and forth to work, am going to compare from last May to this may once the weather warms up and the good MPG trips can be achieved again - just not sure if I can get the great MPG trips like I did.  The reason that think that a hit to the battery may be a factor is that during the best MPG times last year the MFM trip & charge history would always show around 5.5-5.7kWh and now the max normally shows 4.8-5.0kWh. with 5.1kWh the most I've seen in the past couple months.  But then again, the colder weather may be a factor, so waiting for the warmer weather to compare under optimal conditions.