scottp Posted January 1, 2015 at 10:43 PM Report Share Posted January 1, 2015 at 10:43 PM Hi All, I'm considering buying a FFE or FFH, and here's the big question- In Massachusetts, gas is down and electric is up. I do have PV panels on my house, which would cover a small amount of charging above and beyond our household use. My question was this, I know the battery pack in the FFE is 7.6 KwH, but what is the draw from the plug? is it also 7.6 KwH? or, is there loss due too ineffeciency? If so, does anyone know how much you notice in your electric bill? I noticed that the dealer has no '14 FFHs, but a bunch of FFEs in stock, and as the '15s are coming out- I'm wondering if that might translate into a really good buy on the Energi. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
murphy Posted January 2, 2015 at 12:19 AM Report Share Posted January 2, 2015 at 12:19 AM The maximum draw from the plug is 3.8 kW. It takes about 2 hours and 5 minutes to charge a fully depleted battery. Only about 5.5 kWh is available for EV mode. The rest is reserved for the hybrid mode, discharge protection, and full charge protection. The battery never goes to zero and it is never fully charged. Those end points are very hard on a battery so they stay away from them to prevent shortening the life of the battery. I have 10 kW of PV panels on my roof. I haven't paid an electric bill since they were installed in September of 2013. BillinArizona and Da0ne 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scottp Posted January 2, 2015 at 09:25 PM Author Report Share Posted January 2, 2015 at 09:25 PM So does anyone know if the Federal Tax incentive is still active in 2015? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jeff_h Posted January 2, 2015 at 09:33 PM Report Share Posted January 2, 2015 at 09:33 PM So does anyone know if the Federal Tax incentive is still active in 2015? For the purchase of the car, yes it should be as Ford is still a long way from reaching 200k sales of qualifying vehicles. For the charging equipment, that was alive in 2013 and I believe was revived in the last couple weeks of 2014 for that year, but I don'y think it's been repeated for 2015 -- may be, may not be, depends on the horse-trading that goes on in passing laws, etc. Hybridbear 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JATR4 Posted January 3, 2015 at 08:00 PM Report Share Posted January 3, 2015 at 08:00 PM For the charging equipment, that was alive in 2013 and I believe was revived in the last couple weeks of 2014 for that year, but I don'y think it's been repeated for 2015 -- may be, may not be, depends on the horse-trading that goes on in passing laws, etc.Thanks for the info. I was unaware the charging station credit was renewed for 2014. Saved me $243. Whoopee! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jeff_h Posted January 3, 2015 at 10:09 PM Report Share Posted January 3, 2015 at 10:09 PM Thanks for the info. I was unaware the charging station credit was renewed for 2014. Saved me $243. Whoopee! The form hasn't been updated for 2014 yet, below is the link for all versions of the form - or just go to the forms & pubs section and search on '8911' and my guess is that a revised version will be posted within the next week or two (based on looking at revision date from last year) -- the instructions are on the later pages of the form. http://apps.irs.gov/app/picklist/list/priorFormPublication.html?resultsPerPage=200&sortColumn=sortOrder&indexOfFirstRow=0&criteria=formNumber&value=8911&isDescending=false Hybridbear, HotLap and Doug0716 3 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Doug0716 Posted January 3, 2015 at 11:53 PM Report Share Posted January 3, 2015 at 11:53 PM The form hasn't been updated for 2014 yet, below is the link for all versions of the form - or just go to the forms & pubs section and search on '8911' and my guess is that a revised version will be posted within the next week or two (based on looking at revision date from last year) -- the instructions are on the later pages of the form. http://apps.irs.gov/app/picklist/list/priorFormPublication.html?resultsPerPage=200&sortColumn=sortOrder&indexOfFirstRow=0&criteria=formNumber&value=8911&isDescending=false There is a draft version here:http://www.irs.gov/pub/irs-dft/f8911--dft.pdf jeff_h and HotLap 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JATR4 Posted January 4, 2015 at 05:14 AM Report Share Posted January 4, 2015 at 05:14 AM (edited) The form hasn't been updated for 2014 yet, below is the link for all versions of the form - or just go to the forms & pubs section and search on '8911' and my guess is that a revised version will be posted within the next week or two (based on looking at revision date from last year) -- the instructions are on the later pages of the form. http://apps.irs.gov/app/picklist/list/priorFormPublication.html?resultsPerPage=200&sortColumn=sortOrder&indexOfFirstRow=0&criteria=formNumber&value=8911&isDescending=falseIt is already in my 2014 tax program but the form 8911 is not final yet. As soon as the IRS updates their site the tax programs will make the form final. Edited January 4, 2015 at 05:46 AM by JATR4 HotLap 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
rbort Posted January 4, 2015 at 05:42 AM Report Share Posted January 4, 2015 at 05:42 AM (edited) To answer your question scott, you're going to draw about 8kwh on your electric meter to recharge a fully drained pack. You never use up 7.6kwh anyways (battery is not allowed to drain below about 15% charge level) and there are losses in charging hence using up 8kwh even if you only took out about 5.5-5.9kwh from driving out of the pack. -=>Raja. Edited January 4, 2015 at 05:44 AM by rbort BillinArizona 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
saleen436 Posted January 6, 2015 at 08:29 PM Report Share Posted January 6, 2015 at 08:29 PM Hey all, first post here... Jjust purchased a 2015 Energi Titanium lease and loving the car so far! To attempt answering the original question, I had one of those kw gauges from Home Depot lying around and I decided to see how much it registered during a full charge at approx 6 hours. According to the gauge (which you plug in, then plug an appliance into it to get a reading) it came out to $0.57 or something like that. Needless to say I was quite pleased. I believe my energy cost is $0.08/kwh. Hope that helps! BillinArizona 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HotLap Posted January 15, 2015 at 10:40 PM Report Share Posted January 15, 2015 at 10:40 PM Jeff/Doug/JAT thanks for the info/links, I'm not very familiar with this "rebate" for the charging station, can I actually claim the full amount I paid for my Clipper Creek 240V charging station, and how about the electrician cost to wire it? thx - b Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JATR4 Posted January 15, 2015 at 11:33 PM Report Share Posted January 15, 2015 at 11:33 PM Jeff/Doug/JAT thanks for the info/links, I'm not very familiar with this "rebate" for the charging station, can I actually claim the full amount I paid for my Clipper Creek 240V charging station, and how about the electrician cost to wire it? thx - bYes. My cost of Clipper Creek and electrical installation was $811. 30% of that is $243--my credit. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rexracer Posted January 16, 2015 at 12:05 AM Report Share Posted January 16, 2015 at 12:05 AM I noticed that the dealer has no '14 FFHs, but a bunch of FFEs in stock, and as the '15s are coming out- I'm wondering if that might translate into a really good buy on the Energi. It doesn't look like anyone responded to this portion of your post.I agree that now that we are in 2015, left over 2014s should be heavily discounted. I bought my 2013 in December of 2013 and received $10k off of MSRP before any tax credits. By January/February the same dealer had the last two 2013s at 11-12k off. So if you are going to look at them, i would shoot for at least 10k off. I had 4-5 dealers laugh in my face when I said what I was willing to say, and tell me I was crazy and how that would never happen, but once you find the right dealer it is. Several other members here have reported the same discounts. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hybridbear Posted January 16, 2015 at 03:28 PM Report Share Posted January 16, 2015 at 03:28 PM Jeff/Doug/JAT thanks for the info/links, I'm not very familiar with this "rebate" for the charging station, can I actually claim the full amount I paid for my Clipper Creek 240V charging station, and how about the electrician cost to wire it? thx - bRead this article for the answers to your questions: http://www.greencarreports.com/news/1095984_tax-breaks-back-for-electric-car-charging-stations-natural-gas-cars-through-end-of-year Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
josefontao Posted January 16, 2015 at 05:44 PM Report Share Posted January 16, 2015 at 05:44 PM I bought a Kill-a-watt meter yesterday. I was able to charge a nearly depleted battery (had 2% left on it) in 5 hours and 3 minutes according to MFM and the killawatt read 6.8 Kwh. I'm using 120 volts with the ESVE that came with the car. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JATR4 Posted January 28, 2015 at 08:28 PM Report Share Posted January 28, 2015 at 08:28 PM (edited) The form 8911 for the EVSE is apparently final. I was able to print my return today. The tax program denies printing of forms that are not final. Mailing my return tomorrow. Edited January 28, 2015 at 11:05 PM by JATR4 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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