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When does the ICE come on in cold weather?


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12 replies to this topic

#1 OFFLINE   Hybridbear

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Posted 11 November 2014 - 06:30 AM

I searched for this info and found some scattered posts about this but not one topic with all the info so I wanted to start one.

 

I'd like to address two questions in this:

  • Under what circumstances will the ICE come on during a remote start?
  • Under what circumstances will the ICE come on when turning on the car with HVAC off and it set to EV Now?
  • Under what circumstances will the ICE come on when turning on the car with HVAC off and it set to EV Auto?

I can add one data point to the remote start question. Last night I remote started the car from my phone. The outside temp was about 28F and the coolant temp was likely about the same. The remote start settings were set to Auto and HVAC was off when the car was turned off. When I got to the car I was surprised at how little battery had been used up, only about 0.7 kWh and I expected closer to 1.5. I then saw that the catalytic converter temp was up over 800 F which showed that the ICE had run. I don't want that to happen when remote starting, I'd rather the car just use up HVB power.


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#2 OFFLINE   larryh

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Posted 11 November 2014 - 06:57 AM

Make sure the car is in EV now mode before remotely starting the car. I think if the outside temperature is above 0 F the ICE will not start. Also verify the defroster settings for remote start.  I don't know if they make a difference?


Edited by larryh, 11 November 2014 - 01:28 PM.

199291.png

 

 

Tracking MPGe--not MPG.


#3 OFFLINE   Hybridbear

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Posted 11 November 2014 - 06:00 PM

Make sure the car is in EV now mode before remotely starting the car. I think if the outside temperature is above 0 F the ICE will not start. Also verify the defroster settings for remote start. I don't know if they make a difference?

Car is in EV Now, all remote start settings are set to auto. Auto front defrost, auto rear defrost, auto heated seats, auto heat/AC.

Current vehicles

2013 Ford Fusion Energi Titanium - White Platinum Metallic (The Snow Queen on MFM)

2013 Ford Focus Electric - Ice Storm (Elektra on MFM)

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Previous vehicles

2013 Ford Fusion Hybrid SE x2

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#4 OFFLINE   larryh

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Posted 12 November 2014 - 02:39 PM

Is the location that you are remote starting your car a frequent destination, i.e EV+ mode applies?  When starting from frequent destinations in EV Now mode, the car delays turning on the ICE when the outside temperature is above 0 F for the first couple of miles.


Edited by larryh, 12 November 2014 - 02:41 PM.

199291.png

 

 

Tracking MPGe--not MPG.


#5 OFFLINE   stevedebi

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Posted 12 November 2014 - 02:45 PM

Is the location that you are remote starting your car a frequent destination, i.e EV+ mode applies?  When starting from frequent destinations in EV Now mode, the car delays turning on the ICE when the outside temperature is above 0 F for the first couple of miles.

Larry,

I had not realized that the EV+ worked both at the end and at the start a trip. Is that somewhere in the manual, and I missed it?



#6 OFFLINE   larryh

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Posted 12 November 2014 - 03:46 PM

See these and subsequent posts:

 

http://www.fordfusio...ations/?p=10716

http://www.fordfusio...ations/?p=10722


Edited by larryh, 12 November 2014 - 03:48 PM.

199291.png

 

 

Tracking MPGe--not MPG.


#7 OFFLINE   stevedebi

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Posted 12 November 2014 - 04:46 PM

Thanks Larry. I had read some of that thread, but not all of it. And about the lowest it gets here in Los Angeles is the high 30's - and that is rare.

 

Interesting that ford did "dumb programming" with EV+, in that they did not evaluate if the trip was beginning or ending when evoking EV +. By "dumb", I don't mean stupid, just that they used a simpler program rather than a sophisticated algorithm. It seems to me that EV+ was originally intended to get me home at the end of the trip, but the beginning of a trip would seem to be a different circumstance entirely. In this case, I would expect the ICE to come on immediately if that is what the engine programming considers best in very cold weather. There has to be a reason they chose to do that; I'm surprised they either missed this circumstance or just let it go...



#8 OFFLINE   rbort

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Posted 12 November 2014 - 10:06 PM

I only see EV+ come on the return trip home never on the departure trip from home.

 

Some time ago I figured out how to set other EV+ locations by cycling power 11 times in another spot further out of EV+ range but still close to home, i.e. 1 mile from home instead of 1/3 to 1/2 mile or so.  The idea was to extend range at the end to make it home, but later I decided its not such a good idea to dig into the hybrid battery so deep.  Now I just charge some on the way home if I don't think I'm going to make it all the way.

 

-=>Raja.



#9 OFFLINE   larryh

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Posted 13 November 2014 - 01:24 AM

The delay when starting the ICE in cold weather above 0 F when in EV Now mode is not EV+ mode.  The car is in EV Now mode--EV+ mode does not apply.  This is something very different.  This behavior is only exhibited when starting out from a frequent destination (which I assume is the same list of destinations used by EV+ mode). 


Edited by larryh, 13 November 2014 - 01:27 AM.

  • Hybridbear likes this

199291.png

 

 

Tracking MPGe--not MPG.


#10 OFFLINE   stevedebi

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Posted 13 November 2014 - 10:49 AM

The delay when starting the ICE in cold weather above 0 F when in EV Now mode is not EV+ mode.  The car is in EV Now mode--EV+ mode does not apply.  This is something very different.  This behavior is only exhibited when starting out from a frequent destination (which I assume is the same list of destinations used by EV+ mode). 

OK, I used the wrong terminology. The system is using EV Now based on EV+ settings. That still seems strange to me, no matter how it is phrased.

 

I realize the two terms are different, but what you are saying is that at the right temperature, if you start out from an EV+ location the system is forced into EV mode until you get a certain distance. I'm wondering if it isn't the same distance used for EV+ on the return trip.

 

In EV+ mode the vehicle is forced into EV mode within a certain distance of the destination.

 

Different terms, same result - EV mode within a certain geographic area (regardless of what the left display says for EV vs EV+).


Edited by stevedebi, 13 November 2014 - 10:50 AM.


#11 OFFLINE   Hybridbear

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Posted 13 November 2014 - 10:54 AM

Is the location that you are remote starting your car a frequent destination, i.e EV+ mode applies?  When starting from frequent destinations in EV Now mode, the car delays turning on the ICE when the outside temperature is above 0 F for the first couple of miles.

No, the only EV+ location we have is home. No other destinations are visited frequently enough in this car to be stored for EV+ and I have not manually stored any destinations.

 

OK, I used the wrong terminology. The system is using EV Now based on EV+ settings. That still seems strange to me, no matter how it is phrased.

 

I realize the two terms are different, but what you are saying is that at the right temperature, if you start out from an EV+ location the system is forced into EV mode until you get a certain distance. I'm wondering if it isn't the same distance used for EV+ on the return trip.

 

In EV+ mode the vehicle is forced into EV mode within a certain distance of the destination.

 

Different terms, same result - EV mode within a certain geographic area (regardless of what the left display says for EV vs EV+).

I don't think the system is ever forced into EV mode. What Larry is saying is that sometimes the system isn't forced out of EV mode based on cold temps and Larry believes this to be tied to your GPS location being remembered by the car as a frequent destination.


Current vehicles

2013 Ford Fusion Energi Titanium - White Platinum Metallic (The Snow Queen on MFM)

2013 Ford Focus Electric - Ice Storm (Elektra on MFM)

315692.png

 

Previous vehicles

2013 Ford Fusion Hybrid SE x2

252543.png167422.png


#12 OFFLINE   Hybridbear

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Posted 13 November 2014 - 10:56 AM

Larry - thanks for the link to the Cold Weather Observations thread. That is the thread I was looking for, but unable to locate, when I started this thread.

 

I tried turning the front defrost setting to "off" instead of "auto" and the ICE has not started during a remote start event with ambient temps in the 20s since I made this change. It appears that having defrost set to "auto" allowed the ICE to start. We'll be driving the Fusion all weekend and should have more opportunities to test it.


Current vehicles

2013 Ford Fusion Energi Titanium - White Platinum Metallic (The Snow Queen on MFM)

2013 Ford Focus Electric - Ice Storm (Elektra on MFM)

315692.png

 

Previous vehicles

2013 Ford Fusion Hybrid SE x2

252543.png167422.png


#13 OFFLINE   Hybridbear

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Posted 13 November 2014 - 02:00 PM

Today the ICE didn't start during a remote start event, ambient temp was 23 and the ICE coolant temp was about the same.


Current vehicles

2013 Ford Fusion Energi Titanium - White Platinum Metallic (The Snow Queen on MFM)

2013 Ford Focus Electric - Ice Storm (Elektra on MFM)

315692.png

 

Previous vehicles

2013 Ford Fusion Hybrid SE x2

252543.png167422.png









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